MPs in denial of e-democracy?
Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2008 at 1:28pm
12 responses
I’m back from London safe and sound you’d be pleased to know. It shows the strength of blogs in that a colleague didn’t know where I was yesterday and instead of contacting me directly, she said that she ‘just checked my blog, and found out that way.’ So blogging is a superb way of communicating with people without having to talk to people directly- great! I’m sure that will do a world of good for my social skills;-)
So to the E-Democracy conference. Well, it wasn’t what I thought it would be, lets put it that way. The opening speech by Helen Boaden of the BBC was exceptionally useful in highlighting how the BBC is now using new technologies to communicate with people and to encourage grassroots news, but the conference in general fell flat after that I’m afraid to say. It seemed to concentrate a little too much on e-consultations and what methods are being used in such processes, but not its effect, or how politicians are using it. For example, questions were posed to panels of lecturers and consultancy firms- if the politicians do not take e-consultation responses as seriously as formal, written or oral evidence, then why should they invest vital resources to develop it?
I gave my contribution to the day by singing the praises of our e-petitions system and the Welsh blogosphere, but unfortunately the attendance at the workshop on Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales was disappointing- this despite the fact that the devolved nations are clearly leading the way in this field. Its annoying when you go to some London based events when most people do not even consider, or know that we even exist, and put us in the ‘UK’ governance box without a second thought. This does not assist in creating an effective analysis of what is out there, and what is working in the realm of e-democracy.
There’s still a long way to go on this issue. Given that there were only 3 politicians present, it seemed a little like we were preaching to the converted yesterday. Unless politicians see the benefits of, and embrace e-democracy for all that it offers, and not just as an add on to other initiatives, then we will be in the same place next year. See more here from Iain Dale on the final panel discussion of the day. I am too angry to say much. The politicians on the panel clearly saw no use for e-democracy, and especially not blogging. Supposedly they are all men in grey suits. Discuss…
An interesting point that was made in all the talk about the US elections and how Obama used the Internet so successfully was that yes, the US parties are great at gathering people to support them online during elections, but after the furore of the election, they are not so good at sustaining interest, or developing e-democracy all year round. What do you think?
Anyway, must rush. Plenary is starting.
Bethan,
Knowing your genuine passion for using technology to promote and engender political participation, it is difficult to fault much of what you are saying. Perhaps, and this is just a view point, it is exactly because politicians are promoting such issues that people are so switched off about it.
I do think there is a misunderstanding within the political class about the nature of Web 2.0 and wider use of the internet. It is a fluid, reactionary beast, the only consistent being that people like to have the freedom to sow their own seed so to speak. Trying to find ‘models’ and ‘strategies’ in posh buildings in London, however sincere those people and events are, are in fact the very antithesis of how most people use Web 2.0.
Although the medium is a worthy cause to look at, such as utilising social networking websites, the fundamental flaw is the message and messenger. Young people in particular, but also the wider public, switch off when politicians try to communicate to them; be it the normal media channels or some twitterskypeblogspot whizz bang application. Today’s survey in the western mail highlights the lack of trust in politicians…
i don’t know- blamberbell did a survey of AMs on their perception of blogging and it wasn’t very supportive. I dont think politicians are on the ball in the UK compared to America. I totally agree with you on the conference being the antithesis of how people use web 2.0 though. good point.
E-democracy is an important new area. Far more important, in my opinion is that referenda become a central part of democratic participation. Referenda on legislation would interest young and old alike – and it would significantly increase the turnout at election time if referenda were held.
To a certain extent, I think that you are wasting your time in going to conferences to discuss the use of the internet for political discourse.
The best way of evangelising is by “doing the internet” well, as you, Peter Black, Paul Flynn and Glyn Davies so obviously do.
The worst blogs, facebook presences, web sites and so on by politicians are those by politicians who are uncomfortable with the medium but are there because somebody said they should be (Elfyn Llwyd, Nick Bourne and Carwyn Jones come to mind).
If all MPs, MEPs, AMs, MSPs and MLA’s blogged the blogosphere would be clogged up by a load of dross, and the value of the elected representative’s blog would be diminished.
In Wales we are fortunate in that we have at least one good “political heavyweight” blog from each party that has been created organically by people who like blogging and enjoy doing so. That’s the way is should be.
In Wales Plaid Cymru dominates all aspects of internet politics, because party supporters have chosen to exploit the medium. If the party was to “lay down the law” and say that all councillors, all AM’s all MP’s all party officials etc HAVE to have a web presence, then that vibrancy would be lost.
Hi Bethan. With some many reports and discussion of late on the nastiness of blogs, I thought that I would leave a comment to say that this is a first-rate blog and I’m going to become a new regular reader. Sorry to sound shallow, but it looks really good too! Stuart
Like i said Bethan, you have been passionate about it, and spot on in the way you are trying to get momentum behind eDemocracy and what should lead to eInclusion. I just think there is scant recognition by people, non politicos, regarding blogs.
It’s an age thing, and a culture thing. The current “greyhairs” (for want of a better word!) in Politics are used to closed committees, inhouse discussions and such. I think part of it is that if they opened discussion to the general public, they feel they would lose control. Well, that’s democracy, right?
It’s politicans like you, and the people who come after (of whatever party), who will make full use of e-democracy, web2.0 and such. I wouldn’t worry too much about it, the culture WILL change. Lead by example, keep blogging and Twittering and Facebooking and whatever it takes to get your message out there. Everyone else will have to catch up or get left behind, I’m afraid.
Hi again Bethan
>E-democracy is an important new area.
It feels like a depressingly old area to me – when I was doing EGov work for Local Authorities years ago (2003) it was the coming thing then with expensive conferences all over everywhere and people getting funding for white elephant pilot projects.
I think the problem is that it is made into a sexy product that is thought of as a silver bullet.
Where we need to start is with democracy itself at the grass roots, and then looking for “carriers” – which may be bits of E-Democracy or something else. Blogs and social media are the current tools, and they were not created by a conference.
So I’d argue that the way ahead for AMs and the rest of us is to use whatever tools do what you need to do best – and not worry about E-Democracy.
E-Democracy is certainly happening – but it won’t by it’s nature be driven from any centre: it will emerge as is necessary by local causes and campaigns, and it will cost virtually nothing.
For the political centre to get involved, the place any change has to start is with there being some worthwhile local democracy to express – i.e., giving power away. Then there will be a demand for the tools to express it. I’d suggest that is not in place – although Wales is perhaps easier with a more regular council setup than England.
At the moment, there’s too much of a feel of “pull the cart by putting reins on a dead horse”.
As a kicker, can I plug our recent online symposium about Devolution. It’s in the context of England, but it’s bloggers thinking from different viewpoints about getting power further down the tree:
http://www.mattwardman.com/blog/publications/ and the “Devolving England” report or article series.
Rgds
Matt
Hi Bethan, tks for your question yesterday and sorry if the panel session left you angry! I thought it was interesting to see how different people react very differently! I also thought that it was a useful reminder that we have a lot of work to do really getting people to understand what this stuff is all about. By the way, you may be interested in a place we have created for discussions on this sort of thing – http://www.theconnectedrepublic.org. be interested to know what you think.
Hey, I was wearing a grey suit, but was supportive. I am the guy in the middle of the pic, who was chairing the session. I understand that the reason why there were so few listening to Bethan was that the previous chair had said that there was a tea break. I was irritated because I felt that our session got down to some hard lessons about what should be done or not done, to make a petition or consultation a success. Anyway the two of us asked questions in the closing plenary, which exposed the MP emperors without any clothes.
To echo Matt’s sentiments somewhat (I hope), it is certainly no magic bullet, the medium will not paper over the chasm between messenger (the politicians) and the receiver (the public – particularly young people).
I do think there is some credence in the ‘generational’ argument, however, people use Facebook, Bebo and Myspace to check out bands, keep up with friends and share media. The thought of them ever reading a politicians blog, regardless of whether it is on these sites or not, is just not going to happen.
Just because the tools are there to reach out to people through technology, that is merely icing on top of a rotting cake that is our democracy. All the research points to the fact that political participation will continue to decline as the current older generation die out.
Peter Bazalgette’s look at the ‘Tale of two houses’, nails the point vividly. Big Brother, Xfactor and the like offer real participation, a chance to affect the outcome of the show. Politics is remote enough from young people’s lives for them to feel that even the vote is a useless tick in the box.
I support the many democratic reforms that are often offered as things to alter than paradigm, eVoting, fully proportional voting system, votes at 16, week long voting periods, early voting. But these are merely little things they may or may not have any impact. The only way to enthuse young people is to give them the power to shape the world how they see it – and that involves politicians that speak their language giving them that power.
I will blog about this, for I wrote my masters dissertation on this very subject.
Marcus
Hi Bethan, I was at your seminar albeit late because of the afore-mentioned tea break that wasn’t so I missed your part :S
I was also left miffed by the panel session, mostly because most of those present couldn’t disengage from their own agendas. The politically-affiliated present didn’t seem to be able to differentiate between democracy and politics and I left feeling that they thought e-Dem was about blogging or not and being able to add social bookmarks to pages.
So I agree, there’s an element of denial. And perhaps of fear – policy making seems largely to me about personal opinion and lobbying. What happens when you get clear information from the ground that doesn’t support it?
Some great links to follow up from your messages here. It’s all started me blogging too:
http://damianwatson.wordpress.com/